- Foos Rap - Save your goal before it blows out.... - Messages http://www.arizonafoosball.com/forums/jitbit/messages.aspx?TopicID=3765 - Foos Rap - Save your goal before it blows out.... - Messages en-us http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Jitbit AspNetForum Mon, 04 Mar 2019 16:56:43 GMT Mon, 04 Mar 2019 16:56:43 GMT http://www.arizonafoosball.com/forums/jitbit/messages.aspx?TopicID=3765 Message from azrocket Bryan Hendricks wrote:
Pun intended - the issues we all have with the tables are falling on deaf ears.



FYI. My post was a followup to the blown goal issue that some of us had been chatting about. I figured those foosers who own tables might be interested to know what kind of preventive maintenance options they have to extend the life of their tables. It wasn't meant to be a dig on the current state of tables at Dukes/Stingers (although I could see how it might appear that way).]]> Mon, 04 Mar 2019 16:56:43 GMT http://www.arizonafoosball.com/forums/jitbit/messages.aspx?TopicID=3765 Message from Bryan Hendricks Sat, 02 Mar 2019 17:09:23 GMT http://www.arizonafoosball.com/forums/jitbit/messages.aspx?TopicID=3765 Message from BillyBoy Sat, 02 Mar 2019 14:38:43 GMT http://www.arizonafoosball.com/forums/jitbit/messages.aspx?TopicID=3765 Message from azrocket

My goals started rounding out in the back and there were cracks forming right behind the laminate- this is usually when the sides of the goal starts to blow out as you've seen on some of the tables at Dukes/Stingers.

What I did was buy some cyanoacrylate (CA) glue from a woodworking store and filled some syringes and injected them into the MDF (multi-density fiberboard) behind the laminate (you'll need a few syringes as they're only good for one shot, the glue hardens up quick and renders it pretty much useless). I soaked the MDF on each side with several injections and let sit for 24 hrs. Now the back of my goals are rock solid and the cracks are all gone- hopefully that'll help the table last a long time.



Info I gleaned off the net that gave me the idea.


http://foosball.com/forum/index.php?topic=3008.0


Hello,

On the table I just bought the inside of the goal is starting to round out a little....it is very subtle but I can see this being the first sign before chipping.

Does anyone have advice on some kind of adhesive or poly that you can put behind the goal wall and on the corner....or is it just inevitable.

Thanks


here is what I have collected on the subject - for now, I have never heard of a for sure fool proof fix...I have an idea for the future but it is not simple and I need help in development...again, for now, here are your options - 3 approaches

Mark murrell 11/09
It can be slowed or stopped. Go to Walmart, in the section fingernail polish is find something called Hard as Nails. It similar to Krazy glue and is thin like water. Mask any area it might run to where you don't want it. Use a syringe to apply it to the MDF behind the white laminate chipping area. Use as much as the MDF will absorb which isn't much and you will need the slow control the syringe will give you. MDF will soak it up around the damage and become a pretty solid area behind the laminate. If your nervous doing this practice on a square edge of MDF inside the table like the prop stick so you have a feel for how much and how fast it will absorb before drying.

Johnny Lott

Any good woodworking two part expoxy can be used. Probably the easiest to work with is the two part clay like expoxy but that may be too thick for your needs depending on how blown out the wood already is?

Laminant is only as strong as what backs it up and unfortunately if the wood begins to chip its only a matter of time until the laminant chips as well. If this is an ongoing regular occurance with Tornado tables I would premptively treat the wood edge on both sides of both goals to harden it with the 2 part epoxy as soon as you buy the table.

Why? Because once the wood starts to deteriorate the problem is much harder to address.

Also make sure the goal edge of the laminant, (as well as the wood) has a good round over or slightly beveled edge all around the circumference of the goal!!! (a 1/8" round over should do just fine)

If the factory is not doing this properly that will also almost always result in the edges chipping. You can use a fine edged file or even sandpaper to create the proper beveled edge.

It is one of those small quality control things that makes the difference betweeen a quality table with a long life or well, NOT! It's the old weakest link in the chain theory - you can have a perfectly maintained used table but if the goals are blown out its value decreases considerably.

I am not completely familiar with the design of the top cabinet of Tornado, (so I would defer to Mark Murrell here) BUT you might? be able to dissassemble the top rebuild the wood edges with the expoxy (or replace them completely) and relaminate the end walls - if you a handyman and wanted to go to all the trouble? Again I'm guessing here?

Because Laminant by nature is brittle and easily chips on its own, or breaks, you do NOT want to use a rubber cement glue that gives - but something that drys hard and solid! Only a two part epoxy or something along that line of product will dry hard enough to provide a strong backer.

Kilowatt
speaking as a former professional furniture maker and longtime woodworker:

achieving a permanent fix is going to be a bit challenging. a cosmetic fix would be a piece of cake, but since you need something that will not only being basically cosmetically acceptable but also strong enough to endure being pounded by polyurethane balls, and ideally is flat and square to the original wall... that's the issue.

bondo is commonly used in furniture repair work where a filler is needed that doesn't expand or contract. beyond that, it does not have the physical strength to be an acceptable solution.

ideally, a high quality 2-part epoxy, like West System or System 3 (I've used System 3 a lot)- but not like the 2-part crap you can buy at Home Depot in the two tubes- would both bond with and strengthen the underlying damaged MDF substrate and also achieve a level of hardness probably sufficient to endure some level of impact.

problem is that these epoxies maintain some degree of viscosity until they cure (they all cure in an exothermic reaction, so increasing the temperature of the epoxy components prior to mixing will decrease the working time). they can be thickened using thickening agents that don't decrease structural integrity, but still, they're messy and will exhibit some degree of flow. so applying them to a vertical surface is going to require some significant cleanup afterward.

aside from the fact that high quality epoxies are pretty 'spensive, there's the other issue that epoxy doesn't stick well to epoxy that's already cured. so you kinda get one good shot at it.

the putty epoxies are all pretty much crap. not even remotely sufficient for this application. you can try it, but my money is on that stuff just getting knocked off within a day or so.

if the chipping is relatively minor, like less than a 1/4 of an inch in any dimension, i'd first clean the chipped out area using alcohol, then mask off all the nearby surfaces using blue tape (crucially important) and then apply a thickened epoxy using a fast-setting catalyst/hardener. Be sure to choose a thickener that is specifically for strength and not just gap-fill. Follow the directions on the epoxy, and let it cure for twice as long as the instructions indicate. Once fully cured, shape the epoxy with a little scraper or a little thumbnail sized square of sandpaper glued to a stick.

no real reason or benefit to attempting to patch additional laminate on.

if this is all too much, you can get a low-viscosity cyanoacrylate glue (kinda like crazy glue) that will wet the exposed MDF and penetrate into it, hardening it somewhat. again, quality low-viscosity cyanoacrylate isn't something home depot sells, but is pretty easy to find at your local Woodcraft or online.

why not use crazy glue? you can, but decent low-vis cyanoacrylate is a better product for the same price.





edited by azrocket on 3/1/2019
edited by azrocket on 3/1/2019
edited by azrocket on 3/1/2019]]> Fri, 01 Mar 2019 15:45:26 GMT